ToME WikiRavenRed: Just a quick idea.
Currently, there is no real way for thieves to advance a level apart from combat. There are (relatively) small XP gains for stealing and unlocking doors, but these are very small and not much use for going up a level.
My solution? XP for getting away with loot.
On leaving a level, a player recieves the "base" gold piece value of everything obtained on the level divided by (50/Stealing Skill). This applies to both cash and items. Whilst potentially lucrative, this is subject to a couple of important provisos:
- the player cannot kill anyone on the level. If the player kills anything, the XP gainable by this method drops to 0.
- it can only be done once per level. If you want more XP, you need to clear out another level of all its valuables.
- The XP gain is DOUBLED if no monsters on the level wake up.
The practical upshot of this is to make non-violent playstyles practical for level gain. High level stealth-based characters will be able to sneak around the level, pilfering at will and then escaping, with their sneaky skills and reputation enhanced.
2c worth and counting...
BucketMan: Just a thought...you might also want to differentiate between items generated on the floor and items generated in monster inventory. A thief who sneaks up on a Great Wyrm of Power and snatches a golden cup from him should probably be rewarded more than a thief who level scums and picks up piles of gold near the stairs.
RavenRed: Stealing currently gains XP in-and-of itself (as far as I know). That would be double-dipping, but I don't necessarily see that as a bad thing.
Sirrocco: Likewise, the ol' smash-and-grab, while effective, doesn't actually result in learning all that much. Have a further penalty to the exp for not being on the level long enough - multiply by (speed 0 turns on level(max 1000))/1000 or something. For an even more interesting one, multiply the whole thing by (10*value gained)/(total value generated on level). The true call of greed is that ou want it *all* - not just the low-hanging fruit.
RavenRed: Total Stolen as a percent of Total Generated? NICE idea. Dunno how easy it would be to code, especially as respawning would increase that amount as the player spends longer on the level. The time-basis is a good idea, although we perhaps shouldn't penalise speed-theives.
Another thought - instead of wakeup, use perception - random monsters can get generated awake, if you take your time. As long as no monster every sees you or knows that you were there, you get double xp. Beyond that, let's give the assassins a bit of love. Give single xp for either not fighting anything *or* not being perceived. For the assassin, if you can manage to kill everything you encounter in the alpha strike, you get that tasty little bonus. As a secondary bit, you might tie it to sneakiness, rather than thievery, just to encourage people to dip into the playstyle a bit.
RavenRed: Meh... I've always favoured Assassins having instakill capacity for attacks on sleeping monsters a' la the Necromancer's Touch of Death. Instakill with only 1/3 the XP. Given the (relative) lack of risk, I thought they didn't need additional sweeteners. When I said "wake up" I meant have their status changed from sleep to wakefullness as a result of the player...
Sirrocco: the point would be to try to gauge. As soon as the instakill fails once, the bonus is gone, and even instakills make a *bit* of noise. With the other multipliers tweaked right, there would be a constant weighing of "Do I want to risk killing this one? Is it worth the risk to kill this one?" Even better, have a "dungeon level alerted" flag. There would be some monsters (not all) who would raise alarm as soon as they saw you. As soon as the alarm is raised, that's it. That level is alarmed for good. Having the alarm raised significantly increases the chance of monsters waking up and activates wandering monsters. Thief/assassin exp bonuses would be dependent on whether or not the level had been alerted, and some quests would *require* that no alert be sounded. This would also mae a place for a disguise skill. Various disguises could have various limitations (zombies shamble, and do not pick things up) but if someone sees you in the disguise, and you aren't doing anything out of character, and you're not out of place (and your disguise skill beats their perception, perhaps) they assume that you're what you seem to be, and react accordingly. If your pretended faction is at least nuetral to their faction, no alert is raised. Monsters would be set as being able to alert or not, and each dungeon would be set with which factions in that dungeon would call alerts. If they perceive someone in a faction hostile to their own, they call it - so, for example, an Assassin Exemplar wouldn't sound the alert if he ran into you while both of you were infiltrating the Holy Mountain, but if he found you in the Rogue's Den, then he most certainly will.
- Looking at it, that's more like module fodder for someone looking for Random Cool Stuff than something that I'd really expect to see in the core any time soon, but it *would* be cool.
DarkGod: Yes a module specifically made for that would be neat, like you have to break into a dungeon vault or something.