ToME WikiContents
Description
Important characters in the universe of Star Wars are portrayed as living a life quite similar to your typical roguelike hero - they work alone, they're able to defeat large groups of very nasty and all-identical hostile things and they use spells (the Force) or cool equipment. So a roguelike in this setting should be very interesting (if George Lucas doesn't mind it's existence).
Plot
Standard main quest - kill two big bosses (Vader and the Emperor)
Elements
Obviously, some fantasy related elements are out of theme here. Also, equipment-issued resistances should be scarce, as e.g. set of gauntlets in no way can prevent you from melting away in lava.
Elements like fire, electricity, cold, acid, poison, shards, sound, plasma and perhaps light would stay.
There should be new types of damage for blasters and the Force (mana and force would do perhaps).
Equipment
- Melee weapons - only a few kinds, like spears (e.g. Tusken), knives, staves and the most important - lightsabers.
- Ranged weapons - lots of different ones, like blaster rifles, energy bows, rocket launchers etc.
- Armor - ranging from standard clothes through stormtrooper's suit to Lord Vader's armor. Could include permanent mechanical implants. Boosts physical stats, detection, a few resistances here and there (helmets could help with sound or blinding attacks, body armor good against shards etc.)
- Tools - e.g. jet packs, drills
- Jewelry - mostly only trading goods.
- Devices, Potions, Scrolls and the like should be changed a bit, but I don't have an idea how.
Skills
Combat: Weapon skills obviously for different kinds of weapons. Also, several lightsaber fighting styles with different benefits could be interesting. Shooting skills & unarmed combat stay. Devices should go here too, instead of Magic.
- Sneakiness: leave as is.
- Magic: Magic schools removed and changed to Light Force Powers, Core Force Powers, Dark Force Powers. Rename magic to the Force.
- Spirituality: remove all subskills or leave prayer.
- Monster-lore: remove all subskills.
Classes
- Warrior - tribal, melee warrior for races like Ewok or Wookie.
- Trooper - equivalent of an Archer, only more heavily armored (e.g. Stormtroopers).
- Mercenary - equivalent of a Rogue, only more combat-oriented, with good use of devices (think Han Solo or Boba Fett)
- Jedi Knight - lightsaber-swingin', Light Side of the Force usin' intergalactical hero!
- Sith Lord - as above, except this one uses the Dark Side
Races
Humans, Wookies, Ewoks, Hutts, Droids and whatever else populates Star Wars' universe and can wield a lightsaber.
Monsters
As above, plus anything that can't wield the lightsaber, but it's still dangerous, plus more class specific 'monsters' like Stormtroopers, Jedi Knights, Dark Jedi etc.
Dungeons
Treating the world map like the universe with dungeons as planets seems a good idea (pretending that leaving to the world map means 'getting into the ship and flying away'. Most dungeons could use a starting town a la Bree and Barrow Downs. All should be flat perhaps.
Dungeon features
Many as in standard ToME + metal walls + metal floor + big bad pits you can fall in and not get out/teleport level.
Gods
Three possible solutions:
- drop them altogether
- use Light Side and Dark Side as gods. When your piety drops low enough you switch sides. Access to Light/Dark Force powers should be tied to a Skill Formerly Known As Prayer
- invent some gods. or use powerful Jedi/Sith spirits as patrons
Chatter
TheFury: Any relation to this http://angband.oook.cz/screen-show.php?id=307 ?
TheFury: Feel free to use the Jedi stuff from FuryMod
BucketMan: I'd love to see a Star Wars mod. Who wants to make it? As usual though, I think it will require a lot more than just renaming monsters and gods. There's no reason to limit ourselves like this with T3, either. Anybody who plays this is going to want to play either Jedi or Sith, so we could probably do away with all the class choices, and assume that all characters will use the force, and allow the choice of good or evil to come out over the course of gameplay. So elimiate class, and probably gods too. They have no place here. Instead of race, I'd have players choose planet of origin during character creation. Hoth, Tatooine, Alderaan, Coruscant, etc. Different planets would have different quests, different skill trainers, different equipment, etc. So, choice of home planet would determine how the early part of the game would progress. Eventually you'd build up enough money and skill to buy and pilot a ship, or sign up with a faction/organization that would give you quests that would involve off-planet travel. Different factions would grant access to different skills and equipment, but would carry varying degrees of incompatibility with other factions. For example, if you establish yourself with the smugglers, they would allow you to purchase guns, and perform smuggling quests, but this would tend to alienate you from the more legal factions, which would have their own skill/equipment/quest sets. So, you gradually build a character over the course of how you choose to play the game. Instead of a simple kill-the-foo type of ending, there would be two game endings, depending on whether the player chooses to ally themselves with the Empire, or the Rebellion. Whichever path you take, a number of objectives would be required. To defeat the empire, you not only have to defeat the various Sith Lords, you also have to kill Admiral Thrawn, C'Baoth, and either prevent the construction of, or destroy the death star. Winning for the Empire requires not only the death of the various Rebel uniques, but also political expansion of the empire to all systems in the galaxy. I'm seeing the game as having a lot of special levels with puzzles, many different paths to the end-game, and a major political/economic angle in addition to combat. The module would need to track status not only for the character, but also the strength of the various factions. Have psuedo-random quests, and the more quests you perform for a faction, the stronger it becomes. Quests in opposition to other factions would weaken them. For example, if you smuggle weapons to the Rebels on a particular planet, it would strengthen them, but weaken the Empire relatively, and in time such power changes could bring about changes in who is currently considered 'in control' of a planet. So, certain end-game requirements could be brought about not only be killing uniques, but also by finishing quests, and deliberately changing the balance of power throughout the galaxy.
Who wants to make the module?
Sirrocco: I regret to say that I will not be making the module, but... Well, I'd have to say that pulling the option of playing an alien out of Star Wars feels like a mistake - and so does removing the ability to play as a noble, a smuggler, or whatever. In particular, if you're going to be pushing for the "massive profusion of different quests" effect, and the possibility of political endings....
ElCuGo: I'm interested in working in a Star Wars oriented module. Are you still working in it BucketMan? I would like to do it more combat oriented and politics only as background story.
BucketMan: I haven't touched it in months. I spent about five hours on it and concluded to do it justice would require as much effort as Dragonball T, and abandoned it. There's a massive data source at http://starwars.wikia.com which outlines every race, planet, star system, technology, faction, and everything else from every Star Wars book ever written. I made a couple maps, set up a data structure for factions and started working on a random quest system (which has since been adopted by Bubblegum Crisis) and that was about it. If you're willing to do the bulk of the work, we can make it a joint project and I'd be happy to play consultant and build or adapt systems as needed. Maybe make a few maps and so forth. Just so long as it's more interesting than "change the names and kill the foo." Combat oriented is fine, but it will have to be more than renaming 'magic' to 'force' and 'hardened warrior' to 'storm trooper.' Could you describe your vision a little more?
ElCuGo: Wow that's a useful website. Well, first i must say that i'm not a hardcore fan of Star Wars or anything close, but i enjoyed the movies a lot. Well, i started modding ODE to learn Lua and T-engine a little and so far managed to change a few weapons and armor to more thematic items and added a few jedi and sith monsters, i added Darth Vader as the dungeon guardian just for fun heh.
My vision, ok i haven't thought a lot about it but i think it should be class based. I find DBT class system interesting but i haven't been able to figure it out from a gameplay perspective. So the player should be able to chose to start as a Jedi, a Sith (or convert later to the Dark) or a bounty hunter. I would like to have more classes but for a start these should be enough. I'm thinking in setting it in the times of the old republic as i find it more interesting, but i feel that leaving out all the empire fun is not totally right.
So, at beginning a Jedi would start in the temple and take missions from the council, e.g. investigate an assassination attempt of a politician. OTOH i like your idea of semi random quests. Maybe combine plot quest with random quest?
BucketMan: Yes. I had always planned on having both. The random quests were for building up standing with the various factions. For example, there would be a bounty hunter 'guild' and you could request missions from them at any time. Missions would be randomly created, and completable as many times as you want. As you complete (or fail) missions, your standing with the faction is adjusted. Higher standing gives you access to better missions, more equipment, better training, etc. The only difference I had in mind from what you seem to be describing is that I was going to allow anyone to work for any faction they wanted, rather than compelling the player to choose a class at game start. If you want to 'be a bounty hunter' you work for the bounty hunter guild. If you want to 'be a smuggler' you do smuggling missions. But, no reason you couldn't do both. But there would also be 'fixed' missions and storyline quests mostly pertaining to the empire, the rebellion and the force. Becoming a jedi or sith would require advancement to a certain stage and then choosing a side by embarking on appropriate quests. In the star Wars universe, everyone usually had a profession before they learned the force. Mara Jade was a smuggler. Luke was a farmer. Obi Wan was a fighter pilot. Etc.
ElCuGo: My understanding is that Jedi recruited their padawans at a very early age before thay had a profession. Obi-Wan and Luke were the exeptions rather than the rule. But i dunno i'm not completely stubborn.
The features i would like to have
- Lightsaber action with liberal use of the Force
- Ability to convert to the Dark Side to control the galaxy
- Skill-based, with skills gained and improved by means other than leveling-up
BucketMan: What did you have in mind? I'd suggest DBT's enrollment system, of course. It's totally adaptable for other modules, but you mentioned you hadn't figured it out from a 'gameplay perspective.' What needs clarification? You simply train at the places that have the types of skills you want. For Star Wars I'd do away with all the mutually exclusive trainers that DBT has, though I'd probably still keep quest or standing requirements to train past a certain level. Just so long as it's balanced such that there's no quest grinding. Or again, do you have something else is mind? If you have an idea, we could always build it.
ElCuGo: The problem is that i end up dying before i know if any skill i learned was at all useful. There's also the multiple trainer thing each one teaching similar sets of skills just at diferent mods i didn't know what was the benefit of picking one or the other. I guess i shuld try to get a character get past 15 minutes to understand how it really works. I have been thinking a bit in making a game that completely removes the whole leveling thing, but i don't think it would work well for this particular project. I guess it needs a bit of extra brainstorming.
- Ability to pilot spaceships and engage in battles in outer space
- Ability to control mechas, e.g. AT-ATs
BucketMan: What would this be like as far as the player is concerned? Set speed, new hp and armor values based on vehicle, ignore equipment while piloting? If that's all we need, eventually I'm going to be building a system to do exactly that for DBT and Bubblegum Crisis. We could always steal it.
However, i would like to be able to have it finished within a year. So, i would like to keep it a bit simple, but not simplistic. And yes i'm willing to do the job and if you want to work with me that would be great!
BucketMan: Within a year? A lot can be done in a year. The modules in progress have only taken so long because there was no support, no documentation, no one to ask for help...and quite honestly, none of us module makers had a clue what we were doing. Plus the engine has been being developed all this time, and we've occasionally had to wait for features to be implemented. Take a look at ZombieHorror and BoneToBeWild. Both were built in seven days.
- Well i had to take into consideration real life and work, in adition to my other projects. The lack of documentation is a serious drawback and i think some effort could be put in documenting the engine, i guess i could do bit of it as i disentangle a bit of the puzzle. Oh yeah Zombie and Bone are very fun.
In any case, yes, I'd be happy to work with you on this. I emailed you a copy of what I put together three months ago. Why not take a look, experiment a little, and we'll see where it goes. We can mail back and forth, and piece together thoughts for everyone to look at here on the wiki.
- Thanks! I'll toy with it a bit.